Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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 Posted:
Nov 14, 2014 - 23:51 |
 
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Wait, the bias would only be for the top 3 played races?
edit: Oh and the Human so called "artificial" states increase because of promotion is a much better solution, and proof that players will pick up a race they enjoy without any fiddling about. Just give people another intensive to play a given race and they will. Getting killed while competing for a goal is more rewarding than getting killed in "just another game". |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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Nov 15, 2014 - 00:05 |
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I think it should be teams over a certain percentage, like 7.5% or 8% or so, over the previous month. But it could be for the top 3 teams, that might work. maybe add (%-7) to the suitability as a percentage, so a race at 11% is strongly influenced but one at 8% is weakly influenced? |
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Last edited by JackassRampant on %b %15, %2014 - %00:%Nov; edited 1 time in total |
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harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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Nov 15, 2014 - 00:08 |
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The bias is only for the top 3 most played teams, whom ever they be at the time. Will they ever not be the rock mutation teams in CRP though? Doubtful, however the opportunity is there, if coaches wish it.
Human's have a meta-group. It's very well done, and a great thing for blackbox. That's why they're played so much. However, I think this is a one trick pony. You try doing it with another race, and you'll over saturate the market. I.e. you aren't going to get many new punters, just take punters from the human meta group, dilute the concept and make it less enticing.
We can see the hardcore mutation roster supporter's stand point. You aren't going to change that, unless you bring in a newer roster that causes more cas or possibly more grief.
I suspect that most Nurgle and Chaos teams are at the high end of the market (Koadah's page supports this theory). Which means, they must be playing each other more than other races anyway and the suggested change will only come into effect when there is a large amount of high TV/games played teams activating anyway.
A side effect of this, is that high games played teams that need a recovery (bar the top 3) are more likely to get a recovery.....possibly. |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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Nov 15, 2014 - 00:15 |
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Whatever we wanna do let's not punish the griefers or anybody else. Maybe a hard TV cap if a team has played outside that cap within 5 games? That's kinda complicated… maybe the 115% TV cap is the way to go. Giving coaches an option to toggle it off when they activate would be even better. Would that lead to more low-TV cheese again? Not sure. Maybe instead of a percentage it should be a hard value? Ugh.
I fail to see how either the cap or the suitability bump punish anybody. Especially the % cap. This was the Ranked fix ported over directly for Box. It solved some problems and created new ones, just like we knew it would when it was implemented. Now's the time for real creativity…. |
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Last edited by JackassRampant on %b %15, %2014 - %00:%Nov; edited 1 time in total |
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tmoila
Joined: Nov 25, 2012
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Nov 15, 2014 - 00:16 |
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| harvestmouse wrote: | | Extra divisions isn't going to happen. Any idea that increases the amount of divisions we have (apart from academy) is a no go. |
yo
I said
League
Or r u gonna limit leagues? |
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harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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Nov 15, 2014 - 00:24 |
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@JAR I don't really understand most of your last post.
One of the common phrases heard in blackbox is 'If you can't beat them, join them'. This mostly said about CPOMBing. So a griefer; instead of throwing a baseball as hard as he can into the face of somebody else, he's throwing it as hard as he can into the mirror.
It's up to the coaches on how hard they want to throw that ball and in turn it's up to them how they wish to cultivate their own micro-environment (if the change did have an effect).
Who will lose out, are those that wish to create diverse and interesting rosters. A team like 95% Hobgoblin (which I adore) doesn't really have a place in blackbox, however with this change, it would be totally out of the question; which is a shame and an element box is missing. |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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Nov 15, 2014 - 00:27 |
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Ok, so I got that a bit wrong. My bad. 
I still have my reservations, I'd be fine with trying it out. Others might not, but I doubt it's a tweak that will cause any one to stop playing. It could be an improvement.
I'm probably not smart enough to see how it will affect the top three, hence why I thought that the only bashers that would be hit by the changes would be the ones that are a step down (and humans). But I'm most likely wrong anyway. |
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JackassRampant
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 00:28 |
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| harvestmouse wrote: | | Extra divisions isn't going to happen. Any idea that increases the amount of divisions we have (apart from academy) is a no go. |
So, will there be an Academy division? How will it be handled? (This is exciting: my TT peeps need something to encourage them to join FUMBBL.)
And it's okay, I'm not sure I understand all of my last post either. :/ |
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Last edited by JackassRampant on %b %15, %2014 - %00:%Nov; edited 1 time in total |
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harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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Nov 15, 2014 - 00:29 |
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| tmoila wrote: | | harvestmouse wrote: | | Extra divisions isn't going to happen. Any idea that increases the amount of divisions we have (apart from academy) is a no go. |
yo
I said
League
Or r u gonna limit leagues? |
Ok, my bad. By 'league' I thought you meant a 'division'. Your description sounded like a division.
The problem with doing things in league is 2 fold. 1. There are no ratings and this seems to be important. 2. Ease and publicity is lower. It's just not as easy to game there, and this has a subtle but profound affect on the gaming environment.
Like when Faction tried to move to League, it just didn't work.
It's a real shame, because the open format league is the best gaming format available IMO. |
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harvestmouse
Joined: May 13, 2007
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 00:42 |
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| JackassRampant wrote: | | harvestmouse wrote: | | Extra divisions isn't going to happen. Any idea that increases the amount of divisions we have (apart from academy) is a no go. |
So, will there be an Academy division? How will it be handled? (This is exciting: my TT peeps need something to encourage them to join FUMBBL.)
And it's okay, I'm not sure I understand all of my last post either. :/ |
The way Academy used to work, wouldn't work as well now. Also the old Academy, there's no real reason to have it, when you have League.
However there's the same old problem you have with League. League is suited to do almost anything, it's just not enticing.
You could have the most delicious cake in the world, but if you don't have the right name, it won't be as popular as it could.
So, a new Academy concept was thought up. This was to have set teams at different TV. Coaches could then introduce new players to different races at different TVs with popular builds. Kind of resurrection style.
However it will/would take some coding from Christer. Possibly with the new NAF format coming in, some of this coding will be duplicated. So it could mean a step closer to an Academy division.
A couple of coaches (1 in particular) did a lot of work on race builds (you'd have to find the thread as I can't remember who). |
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Dunenzed
Joined: Oct 28, 2011
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Nov 15, 2014 - 01:11 |
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Humans are popular enough to be caught by the popularity bias from time to time. Part of that's my fault. It looks like I account for about roughly 8-10% of Human games played since the scheduler change going by Koadah's stats. I'm still trucking along with an average a bit under 1 game a day with them in the Box.
My team is sitting at number 3 on the most played teams list in the box. My fellow top 10 teams make for poor reading.
With the worst for and against cas ratio in the top ten you can hardly say I'm afraid of the blood. I'm a pixel hugger, a team builder, and a roleplayer - however I consider none of these an insult. I prefer to win, but not at the expense of a fair fun game for both players. I'm not an old timer, but I've seen enough to know that unfairness comes from many sources, not just TV gaps. Matched TV games by no means guarantees a fair game.
I love the scheduler, as it removes the pick or be picked element from organising a game. But it gets a bit tedious playing the same build over and over. I don't want another evenly matched TV game against cpomb - I've played that match 200 times before.
I'm not adovcating for custom rules to nerf the killstack in the Box - that's not on the table. But the rules the scheduler uses for match making aren't set in CRP.
I love the box, I do not fear the blood, and I would welcome the suggested popularity bias - even though my humans are likely to be caught by it from time to time. |
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koadah
Joined: Mar 30, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 01:51 |
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| harvestmouse wrote: |
So, a new Academy concept was thought up. This was to have set teams at different TV. Coaches could then introduce new players to different races at different TVs with popular builds. Kind of resurrection style.
However it will/would take some coding from Christer. Possibly with the new NAF format coming in, some of this coding will be duplicated. So it could mean a step closer to an Academy division.
A couple of coaches (1 in particular) did a lot of work on race builds (you'd have to find the thread as I can't remember who). |
I couldn't really see this being very popular. Building a team is too big a part of the experience.
Christer did mention this once but I couldn't really see how Academy would work with the new gamefinder.
As for the stats the are skewed by a handful of maniacs who need a wife & kids to occupy their time. Or maybe a mistress.
If the solution is to ban four or five accounts then go for it. 
Personally I hate lizardmen. Bye Cameron. 
Though I'd still nerf CPOMB.
And add a "Transfer to league" button.  |
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Balle2000
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 02:09 |
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| JackassRampant wrote: | | I think it should be teams over a certain percentage, like 7.5% or 8% or so, over the previous month. |
This is not far away from Christer's latest post. Some of what he says is along these lines. Everyone who are unsure of what the suggested scheduler change is, should also check this post out. |
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Mr_Foulscumm
Joined: Mar 05, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 02:32 |
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So I wasn't wrong. It does affect more than the top three teams. |
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Balle2000
Joined: Sep 25, 2008
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| Posted:
Nov 15, 2014 - 04:48 |
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Yes. In the one example solution Christer outlines (which is not final at all) any overplayed race will receive a suitability dampener in line with it's over-representation. |
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