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2008-11-23 06:50:59
78 votes, rating 4.2
78 votes, rating 4.2
Saying "sorry" after killing opponents' players
Some say yeah! when they kill a player; some say sorry to be polite; some say sorry because they really are sorry. And yes, that can apply even for CAS caused through fouls. Personally, every block and every foul i make, i'm hoping for badly hurt. It helps me win the game and doesn't make the game any less fun for the other coach. Also, there's less chance of the opponent using the apo if it's only a badly hurt, which means more chance of the player not returning for the rest of the game.
It sucks to get one of your players killed. Knowing that, anyone with a decent level of empathy will know how his opponent feels when it happens to him, and feel sorry for it.
One thing i don't like about Fumbbl is that there are too many kids here. On tabletop, i've never played against someone who was younger than 18 years old, and i wouldn't want to either. Kids naturally have less empathy than adults, and are just generally less fun to play against. They also tend to put too much value on winning, and not enough on having fun, and more to the point in making sure that the other coach has fun as well, which i believe is a crucial component in what is after all a social game.
Another negative point here is the part of the crowd who see this as an online computer game, rather than as a social board game. Those people tend to be less chatty, and generally just less fun to play against. gl hf gg cu, that's not chat, and that's not fun. The most fun games i've played had nothing to do with what actually happened on the field, and everything to do with the conversation around it. It's just too bad that so many people don't see that.
So remember, when someone says he's sorry, maybe he actually is. Just because you don't feel sorry when you kill a player, doesn't mean everybody else feels the same way. So when someone says sorry, take it for what it is, or at least give your opponent the benefit of the doubt. And don't berate him for being a good guy.
I'm not saying you should say sorry when you kill a player. You do what you think best, what fits your personality and what fits the situation. Just don't be mad at people who think differently and who do feel the need to express sympathy.
That's it, rant over. Game on, chat away, and most importantly, do your best to ensure that your opponent is having fun as well. That way everybody wins.
It sucks to get one of your players killed. Knowing that, anyone with a decent level of empathy will know how his opponent feels when it happens to him, and feel sorry for it.
One thing i don't like about Fumbbl is that there are too many kids here. On tabletop, i've never played against someone who was younger than 18 years old, and i wouldn't want to either. Kids naturally have less empathy than adults, and are just generally less fun to play against. They also tend to put too much value on winning, and not enough on having fun, and more to the point in making sure that the other coach has fun as well, which i believe is a crucial component in what is after all a social game.
Another negative point here is the part of the crowd who see this as an online computer game, rather than as a social board game. Those people tend to be less chatty, and generally just less fun to play against. gl hf gg cu, that's not chat, and that's not fun. The most fun games i've played had nothing to do with what actually happened on the field, and everything to do with the conversation around it. It's just too bad that so many people don't see that.
So remember, when someone says he's sorry, maybe he actually is. Just because you don't feel sorry when you kill a player, doesn't mean everybody else feels the same way. So when someone says sorry, take it for what it is, or at least give your opponent the benefit of the doubt. And don't berate him for being a good guy.
I'm not saying you should say sorry when you kill a player. You do what you think best, what fits your personality and what fits the situation. Just don't be mad at people who think differently and who do feel the need to express sympathy.
That's it, rant over. Game on, chat away, and most importantly, do your best to ensure that your opponent is having fun as well. That way everybody wins.
Comments
Posted by shanecottom on 2008-11-23 07:34:44
Man, I feel bad for you, cutting out such a large percentage of your potential opponents for no good reason. I've played several games against people under 18 on the tabletop, some of them being actual kids, and had a good time with most of them. Kids get things in a way that we don't - a lot of them really know how to have a good time. I appreciate that about them. To be honest, I think I envy it a little bit.
I would say that hands down, I have run into worse sportsmanship across the board (not just in Blood Bowl) from adults than from kids. So give 'em another shot. Or at least don't run 'em down in such a public forum. I know that the internet is the place to spout negativity that is barely grounded in fact about this group or that, but maybe we should take it easy on kids.
I would say that hands down, I have run into worse sportsmanship across the board (not just in Blood Bowl) from adults than from kids. So give 'em another shot. Or at least don't run 'em down in such a public forum. I know that the internet is the place to spout negativity that is barely grounded in fact about this group or that, but maybe we should take it easy on kids.
Posted by Jonas72 on 2008-11-23 08:28:09
Zombie69..I couldn't have said it better myself. :)
Cheers!
Cheers!
Posted by groovycheetah on 2008-11-23 11:08:56
lol i have played league BB minis and every1 around me calls out for blood when a guy gets knocked down on either team but i always say srry any way online any way
Posted by Ehlers on 2008-11-23 11:21:42
Sorry, my rating for your blog is 1.
Posted by Sneakypete on 2008-11-23 11:23:38
I am one of those that really are sorry when I kill or permanently hurt a player.
You are so right about that part ( I dont know if I agree with the under 18 thing but thats really not the issue here hehe)
Off course BLOODbowl is about blood and of course i hope for more than a knocked out when I block someone. But I only want and need to Badly hurt them or at max SI with only next game missing. Thats more than enough for me.
It makes my game easier to win and it gives 2 cas spp. Thats all I need plus the stisfaction of seeing blood. Gett ing players killed gains me nothing neither on the field or behind the screen.
I actually just come from a game where the score was 2-1 to me and we were in last half and was lining up for me kicking round 8-7 into action.
I gave him the 3 standard target dummies to block and he went at them with delight with his 3 blocks + 1 blitz only succeeding in knocking one over. I think the game is over, but boy was I wrong. He then all of the sudden decides to go for a foul as well assisted by as many as possible and thus killing my amazone blitzer. Asking him why and what he gained from that half arsed move he just answered "sweet sweet satisfaction" and then left the game. What puzzles me the most was that it had actually been a clean and good sported match all the way untill that last minute move.
You are so right about that part ( I dont know if I agree with the under 18 thing but thats really not the issue here hehe)
Off course BLOODbowl is about blood and of course i hope for more than a knocked out when I block someone. But I only want and need to Badly hurt them or at max SI with only next game missing. Thats more than enough for me.
It makes my game easier to win and it gives 2 cas spp. Thats all I need plus the stisfaction of seeing blood. Gett ing players killed gains me nothing neither on the field or behind the screen.
I actually just come from a game where the score was 2-1 to me and we were in last half and was lining up for me kicking round 8-7 into action.
I gave him the 3 standard target dummies to block and he went at them with delight with his 3 blocks + 1 blitz only succeeding in knocking one over. I think the game is over, but boy was I wrong. He then all of the sudden decides to go for a foul as well assisted by as many as possible and thus killing my amazone blitzer. Asking him why and what he gained from that half arsed move he just answered "sweet sweet satisfaction" and then left the game. What puzzles me the most was that it had actually been a clean and good sported match all the way untill that last minute move.
Posted by Emeyin on 2008-11-23 12:25:50
Good blog post.
Posted by PurpleChest on 2008-11-23 14:19:59
Some kids can be great, some can be rostern.
Just like the adult world.
But you point about saying sorry gets you a 6.
Just like the adult world.
But you point about saying sorry gets you a 6.
Posted by clarkin on 2008-11-23 14:43:04
I'll almost always cheer any casualty my players can cause on the pitch, but when I do say sorry (generally vs a chatty fun opponent) I mean it. Good point about taking 'sorry' as intended :)
Posted by Mr_Foulscumm on 2008-11-23 15:19:02
If I kill: \o/
If you kill: \o/
If you kill: \o/
Posted by rostern on 2008-11-23 15:56:01
Hihih nice blog
Posted by Peter_Thorpe on 2008-11-23 18:11:20
personally it depends on my mood, sometimes i play matches to have fun, some to be competitive for practice, and sometimes (like the stereotyped under 18's), i like a game just to smash some players
when i say sorry, i always mean it, mainly because if i dont mean it, i dont say it
but when something dies, from either side, why not laugh? its only pixels after all
when i say sorry, i always mean it, mainly because if i dont mean it, i dont say it
but when something dies, from either side, why not laugh? its only pixels after all
Posted by Mates on 2008-11-23 19:31:17
I've played on this site since I was 15. Back then, I really cared about players, I really felt sorry when I killed someone and I was upset when one of my players died. I always said "sorry" when I killed or permanently injured someone, and I meant it. After year or two, I started to realize that I say sorry just out of habit, and stop doing so. Now I'm 18 and I absolutely agree with Mr_Foulscumm's comment.
Yeah, and I don't know where you get that many people on Fumbbl are kids, as far as I know there really aren't many people under 18.
Yeah, and I don't know where you get that many people on Fumbbl are kids, as far as I know there really aren't many people under 18.
Posted by Dragons on 2008-11-23 21:16:57
6 for me.
Dont agree with the children, but to say sorry and mean it happens. Not every coach want to kill players.
Dont agree with the children, but to say sorry and mean it happens. Not every coach want to kill players.
Posted by Pirog on 2008-11-24 14:04:23
I agree with you. Sympathy means a lot, even if it's over pixels representing an imaginary player. There can still be sentimental value and time invested in a fictional character.
It's all about readin the your opponent. If he laughs at you killing his players you can joke about it, if he's pissed off about it you would do well in offering sympathy.
The only thing I might disagree with is the kid thing. Generally it works, but I really don't think there is that many kids here on Fumbbl. Blood Bowl is a bit too complex for most kids. There is however, like most other internet games, a crowd of antisocial geeks that just seems completly unable to feel empathy for other people. Maybe it's because they rarely meet real people and have lost touch with that they are actually facing other human beings.
The comfort when facing these antisocials is that whatever they do to your team you still can never really lose to someone who doesn't have a life.
It's all about readin the your opponent. If he laughs at you killing his players you can joke about it, if he's pissed off about it you would do well in offering sympathy.
The only thing I might disagree with is the kid thing. Generally it works, but I really don't think there is that many kids here on Fumbbl. Blood Bowl is a bit too complex for most kids. There is however, like most other internet games, a crowd of antisocial geeks that just seems completly unable to feel empathy for other people. Maybe it's because they rarely meet real people and have lost touch with that they are actually facing other human beings.
The comfort when facing these antisocials is that whatever they do to your team you still can never really lose to someone who doesn't have a life.
Posted by catmando on 2008-11-25 06:32:56
I agree with your opinion. But it's just kids who are callous when it comes to killing your players. I've met many in TT leagues who'll kill your player and rub it in your face. I hate it when I kill someone's player, especially a player who has alot of SPP's, because I know they went through alot trouble to skill that player. I apologise in those situations. I almost never apologise for killing unskilled rookies. But for some the win is the thing and that's all that matters. Nevermind they lost and three people on their team got skill rolls. The only thing that they cared about is that they lost the game.
Good blog...
Good blog...
Posted by paulhicks on 2009-02-10 01:15:21
Sorry for adding a comment so late after the blog but i only just saw it.
You are of corse quite right about peoples right to be sorry for an opponent EVEN when they have deliberately increased their chances of causiing a cas with dp/ b/ rsc etc.
One thing i would pick up on is:
"It sucks to get one of your players killed. Knowing that, anyone with a decent level of empathy will know how his opponent feels when it happens to him, and feel sorry for it."
This simply isn't true imo. I work with children who have severe special needs and with children who are the victims of abuse in te real world and can assure you there are few people with a higher level of empathy than me. This empathy crosses over into a social game like bloodbowl and i CAN put myself in the other players shoes when he looses a player ... but that doesn't mean that i have to feel sorry for him.
I can understand why he is sorry... i just don't have to be sorry myself in order to have empathy.
Apart from that minor point... nice blog :)
You are of corse quite right about peoples right to be sorry for an opponent EVEN when they have deliberately increased their chances of causiing a cas with dp/ b/ rsc etc.
One thing i would pick up on is:
"It sucks to get one of your players killed. Knowing that, anyone with a decent level of empathy will know how his opponent feels when it happens to him, and feel sorry for it."
This simply isn't true imo. I work with children who have severe special needs and with children who are the victims of abuse in te real world and can assure you there are few people with a higher level of empathy than me. This empathy crosses over into a social game like bloodbowl and i CAN put myself in the other players shoes when he looses a player ... but that doesn't mean that i have to feel sorry for him.
I can understand why he is sorry... i just don't have to be sorry myself in order to have empathy.
Apart from that minor point... nice blog :)
Posted by arw on 2009-06-02 19:47:29
I get what you mean but can't share that view at all.
My best game on Tabletop *ever* against a friend of mine was the best game *because* we teared each others teams apart.
We laughed insanely and planned murder in cold blood: that's been a really thrilling challenge- not some warmed up afternoon entertainment. That's what makes BB more intense than other games.
Sometimes I am sorry, too: fine. If I kill the fifth player during a meaningless and onesided dicerape against a beginner- sure. There are other occasions, too: So far I agree.
Fine- BUT:
If I ask "Hey: you want to play my bloodthirsty Norse?" and you agree just to say "sorry" when killing a player I am clearly disappointed. Just not the game-spirit I was hoping for.
It's like lowering the stakes already set in a game of poker.
Lowering intensity has nothing to do with being friendly- I'd never trust a friend unable to utter criticism even though it might hurt. Meaningless.
My best game on Tabletop *ever* against a friend of mine was the best game *because* we teared each others teams apart.
We laughed insanely and planned murder in cold blood: that's been a really thrilling challenge- not some warmed up afternoon entertainment. That's what makes BB more intense than other games.
Sometimes I am sorry, too: fine. If I kill the fifth player during a meaningless and onesided dicerape against a beginner- sure. There are other occasions, too: So far I agree.
Fine- BUT:
If I ask "Hey: you want to play my bloodthirsty Norse?" and you agree just to say "sorry" when killing a player I am clearly disappointed. Just not the game-spirit I was hoping for.
It's like lowering the stakes already set in a game of poker.
Lowering intensity has nothing to do with being friendly- I'd never trust a friend unable to utter criticism even though it might hurt. Meaningless.
Posted by mymLaban on 2009-06-02 21:31:02
pffffft Theres no excuse for saying sorry, its pointless and lame. Its exactly the same as a soccer match or tennis match for that matter, you didnt see barcelona saying sorry to Man U when the scored a goal did you? Ofcourse not its the idea to score just like the idea is to kill opponents player with your khemri or orc team. It really dosent borther me that much though im just saying it is kinda silly.
I dont agree with your view on kids either mate, its not the kids that puts to much value in winning its the adults.
I dont agree with your view on kids either mate, its not the kids that puts to much value in winning its the adults.
Posted by FatEddie on 2010-02-20 22:30:22
Very true, i often say sorry if i like the opponent and i can see they have a love for their players. Not sure about the kids thing mind you as iv mostly played adults on here and find they are usually the more immature and cr focused players.
Posted by Marcellus on 2010-11-08 05:18:00
I had a game a week ago or so where my opponent became offended after I apologized for a casualty. He was absolutely convinced that I was being rude -- and he would not let it go for the rest of the game.
What you get for playing with a 12 year old I would guess . . .
What you get for playing with a 12 year old I would guess . . .