Posted by spelledaren on 2025-03-29 09:03:57
While being very different from the initial idea, I for one think I prefer the accidental version. It gives you a chance to keep using your team to try and try again. I do love it when teams build their own history, so anything that keeps teams playing long term seems worthwhile to me.
Posted by Java on 2025-03-29 09:04:11
This bug is more extensive than I perceived it to be!
Resetting your run to zero, by going to pickeroon for one match? Sounds crafty. Not sure how I feel about that. If that's the price to pay for IDT being a competition ALSO for perennial teams, maybe it's worth it.
As I said before IDT has more of a chance to be a driver of games for S2+ box if it entices people to spin again with old teams, rather than only being relevant to people that started from scratch for the season. It might change the balance of power but it would differentiate the competition more from BBT.
Posted by Joost on 2025-03-29 09:07:06
I agree with Java. It differentiates by being a reason to play S2+ teams.
Posted by Joost on 2025-03-29 09:08:56
Also, on the naming: a medal is a trophy strictly speaking. How about “cups” for tourneys and “medals” for bbt and idt runs?
Posted by DaCoach on 2025-03-29 09:12:12
My 2, well 3 cents:
1. Love the idea of these trophy competitions - have really complemented the rest
2. I like teams regardless of season to compete - and not rewarding a use and discard rookie team approach.
3. Totally support this - never felt right to me putting them equal to minors and majors, while a tournament recorc of some kind is always cool.
Posted by tussock on 2025-03-29 09:32:39
I like sprints, as a thing, having recognition for a good run with any team seems like a better concept to me than just starting new teams all the time whenever you get a few losses.
And well, we already have the Rookie Rumbles for people who want to play a few games over and over with new teams while checking for ideal randoms.
Box Trophy replaced the variety sprints of the old Abandoned Races Race, and Elves Leaving the Forest to some extent, something for people wanting to play a bunch of games with a few teams, and then try something new next time.
And Majors are great if you develop a really strong roster, and then stop playing it so it's good for the next major.
There's not really anything for, building up a great roster that you can win with a lot and just keep on playing it. That's what IDT could be, like the old Box Belts, best run of 15 games, only, with a limit on recognising more modest performances. You could still pick up a few IDT medals with your box trophy run, or your major prep, or sticking with a rookie rumble team that got early wins. It just works for everyone, but it still quite hard to get any of.
Posted by Rijssiej on 2025-03-29 09:50:19
I like that it is not only for new teams as it gives existing teams something to play for. So I would keep that. I don't care for the option for coaches to reset their run for a team, or go again with the same team while the IDT is running. I prefer that games prior to the start of the IDT season are not taken into account for eligibility to enroll.
I'd like to keep the rules as simple as possible:
- All teams enroll automatically every season.
- When a team gets 3 losses (draw=half a loss) or plays a game outside box/tournament the score for that season gets frozen.
- Anyone that gets 10+ wins in a season with a team gets a trophy for the roster
- At the end of the season top 3 get a gold/silver/bronze medal on their coach page
Posted by koadah on 2025-03-29 09:58:03
Gotta go for option 2 if it may edge us a bit closer to getting sprints :D
Also, some S2+ love!!!
Might help encourage some Majors participation.
S2+ Trophy is the thing though. ;)
Posted by Christer on 2025-03-29 10:12:06
A little clarification regarding Java's comment:
You can not "reset" your IDT run by going into the open gamefinder. Once a team is in the IDT (meaning after playing their first eligible match within a season), that marks the start of their run. Playing an open gamefinder game after that will permanently "freeze" the team for the season. In the current implementation, however, they will be able to restart an IDT run in the next season.
Posted by Sp00keh on 2025-03-29 10:39:40
I like what BBT did for the C division in terms of diversity and popularity
But the downside imo is it forces a constant churn of new teams
I get attached to teams and don’t wanna keep replacing them
(Actually, would it be possible to have something like a full-reset button when redrafting so that teams go back to 1000k and then can be reused in another BBT?)
So for me, IDT as something for ongoing teams, and BBT for new teams, is a nice idea
The downside is perhaps some well built teams use their previous history to get an advantage… but I don’t think that’s a big issue
It maybe helps by making more rosters viable to getting to 10 wins.. currently it favours amazons and Norse as they’re strong right from game 1
Thanks for all your efforts
Posted by koadah on 2025-03-29 11:48:23
How much does IDT really mean to people?
Is it a driver to playing more games?
How often do people check the rankings?
How important is getting the 10 game badge to people?
Personally, I wouldn't come back for it.
S2+ Trophy does at least seem interesting to me. Especially if I could transfer my team to [L]eague after season two or three. ;)
New teams would be allowed but one S2+ team would make it an S2+ squad.
Posted by MattDakka on 2025-03-29 11:50:00
I vote for this option:
"2. Change the rules and make the way it works now the intended way. This makes it more of a "sprint" system, where coaches can prepare their teams for an IDT run and then make an attempt with their built-up team."
BBT should be for new teams, IRONDWARF for Season 2+ teams.
Posted by CrisisChris on 2025-03-29 12:00:47
I share the thought about a blackbox competition for all those 'not zero games played' teams. But I also like the idea of having an alternative to the full 60 games for fresh teams.
The question is: Would it be an issue to use the current rules 'no GF games' (Box and drawn tournaments only) in the current season to be eligible and maybe have even two rankings? One for fresh and one for the other teams.
For the 10 wins before freeze badges, Idk if there needs to be an Differentiation.
Posted by razmus on 2025-03-29 12:51:42
I hate to jump on the bandwagon, but I'd also vote to extend the IDT to the 'accidental' version which gives established teams an additional reason to play on.
Posted by DoctorMidnight on 2025-03-29 13:25:51
The "no GF games" format is an absolute necessity.
Some Minors are plagued by GF teams built on noobs' shoulders, I don't want to see the IDT suffering the same disease.
Being able to win 10 or even more Black Box games in a row without losing is much harder than winning some Minors. It's like winning 2 or 3 RRRs in a row.
So, being the best coach with a given roster deserves at least a Gold Star, even 2 maybe.
Being the best of the IDT deserves a Triple Star.
Compared to such achievements, winning a Brawl with an OP GF team is inferior.
Posted by koadah on 2025-03-29 14:14:54
You can win a Major Qualifier by winning only one game these days.
Maybe against a noob coach. Maybe zero games if the noob doesn't turn up.
Maybe Majors could use some restructuring for modern times.
Posted by DoctorMidnight on 2025-03-29 14:29:56
+1 with Koadah.
As I already said in other posts, both Majors and Minors should be "NO GF teams allowed" tourneys.
The Black Box Trophy, the IDT and the RRRs are in my eyes the only meaningful competitions among all the official Fumbbl tourneys.
No GF teams, no fillers, no victory after 1 or 2 games.
Posted by Zelmor on 2025-03-29 19:47:06
Just a user story. With redraft implemented, all I want to play with are my existing, redrafting teams. I hope to consolidate to 1-2 teams for each race in the long run. That's the game I enjoy, league format with progression, but black box gives me the comfort of playing it whenever I am able. I have not looked at IDT since implemented. If it reset with the failure state instead of locking for the entire IDT season, it would be more interesting as I would know historically what was my best run with the team, if I did better this time than last. I wish there was something for redrafted teams instead of fresh new ones. As it stands now,even BBT lost my participation and enthusiasm.
I have no ideas on how this could be improved. BBT is great if you look at teams as disposables. But I like progression and having a story to tell.
Posted by Sp00keh on 2025-03-29 20:24:51
🏆 and 🏅 on homepage
Posted by DoctorMidnight on 2025-03-29 22:43:17
Single/double/triple stars are for the official Fumbbl formats.
Golden disks are for all the unofficial formats.
Do we need more "granularity" for our trophy rooms?
I'm not sure....
But, if we go for adding some new shiny toys, imho it should be to make meaningful formats shine (please see supra to get my definition of a "meaningful format").
So, we could have the Golden Cup icon as a reward for being:
- the Black Box Trophy winner
- the Iron Dwarf Trophy winner
- the Steel Gauntlet winner
Then, the blue-ribbon medal icon as a reward for being:
- the best [name a roster] coach of the BBT
- the best [name a roster] coach of the IDT
And.... that's it.
Posted by BeanBelly on 2025-03-29 22:47:40
Option 2: useful having a competition that extends into multiple Seasons (whilst also including S1).
10 game badge is a nice achievement, I’ve played a couple of teams deliberately to compete for that. Trying to collect all the badges will make me coach different Rosters over time.
Overall Winner (or medal placing) makes for a good high level of competition, though the field is more limited ie. probably doesn’t include me : )
Definitely the right thing to separate it out from Major/Minor awards as it’s different beast.And no less of an achievement.
I am cautious about any ‘reset’ within a trophy season calendar; feels better that a team should only get one chance each time the competition runs.
Posted by Dalfort on 2025-03-29 22:53:53
As someone who has never had 5 consecutive wins in almost 4.4k games it has never been of interest to me and I never check it. I do love how you and the team are constantly striving to come up with new and inventive ways to increase engagement and I appreciate it massively.
Posted by DoctorMidnight on 2025-03-29 22:57:12
.... or not.
Creating an "Iron Dwarf Trophy Take 2" would be interesting.
Same format, same new shiny toys as described above, black box team building only.
It would reward people who love playing teams with some "history".
I'm pretty sure that all those remarkable formats and their new rewards will help to keep (or even boost) the Black Box diversity.
Posted by DoctorMidnight on 2025-03-29 22:58:32
addendum : my "... or not" follows my "that's it" ;)
Posted by DoctorMidnight on 2025-03-29 23:06:31
The "illustrated Bingo" of the IDT is a very cool feature.
But I still think it would be more motivating if everybody could see your collection :)